Often times when asked what our favorite anime and characters are, we’re also asked what anime and characters we hate. For most fans, it’s easy to rattle off a number of anime they despise and characters they wish would disappear into oblivion. When I’m prompted with this question however, I find that I have difficulty answering it. I could ramble on and on about anime and characters that I love (which I’m sure you’ve seen me do on the blog!) but I’m unsure when it comes to proclaiming my hate…
According to my MAL list, out of the approximately 320 anime titles I’ve seen (which includes completed anime, dropped anime, currently watching anime, and on-hold anime) I would honestly say that I dislike less than 10 of them. I haven’t rated any title below a 5, and even ratings of 5 and 6 are rare for me. If asked which of these titles I hate, the only one I could really go on about is the second season of Nogizaka Haruka no Himitsu, which I already did in a past post, or the one painfully predictable Bleach movie I’ve seen. Even for Pandora Hearts and Heroic Age, two of the very few anime I’ve dropped, I wouldn’t say I hated them – I just found them boring and lacked the motivation to continue watching them after I fell behind. Same with [C], Dance in the Vampire Bund, and other anime I gave lower ratings to. I was turned off by their flaws but I did see the good in them too and derived some enjoyment.
Like anime titles themselves, when it comes to naming characters I hate, out of the hundreds or even thousands I’ve seen, there are relatively few I strongly dislike. I actually discussed the majority of them already on a previous post. For most characters, I either like, love, or am neutral to them. For the ones I dislike, I either find their personality distasteful to me, or they do things that are disturbing, frustrating, cruel, or just plain unfitting for a character who’s supposed to be a protagonist (and they don’t develop out of it either). But even though I have my criteria for characters I hate, why do I still hate so few? And even for the characters I do dislike, I wouldn’t join any online club or forum specifically about hating that character, nor would I ramble on about it anywhere actually. I would even be able to point out their good points even though I dislike them overall.
So what can I conclude about my lack of hate within anime fandom? In terms of the Internet slang word “hater,” I would say I’m the farthest thing from one. Of course I have my few series and characters I don’t like, but that’s as far as it goes. I guess you could say there’s hate and then there’s passionate hate. We all can’t help but feel at least a little of the former, but the latter is the makings of a hater and I try to avoid that. Since anime is a hobby that brings me more pleasure than most anything else, I want to emphasize what I love about it and not what I hate. I’ll definitely acknowledge the bad but I want to revel in the good. I’m open to just about all genres of anime, so I’ve become very tolerant of different character archetypes. When it comes to choosing which series to watch, I’ve gotten to know which series I would like and which I probably won’t enjoy as much. I think a lot of fans who spend as much time hating certain anime/characters as praising certain anime/characters are either 1) basically fans of just one or a few genres of anime, and though they try to branch out and watch other genres sometimes, they just end up hating on them, or 2) they’re only looking for very creative or artistically and intelligently stimulating anime, and any title that relies on cliches or established archetypes rather than uniqueness is an automatic punching bag. When I watch anime however, instead of thinking “Does this match my idea of what’s good?” I think “What large, or small, amount of enjoyment can I derive from this?” I guess I’m just a glass half full kind of fan ;)
So now I ask of my fellow fans, do you find it just as easy to discuss anime and characters you hate as those you love? Do you ever go out of your way to make your hatred known, or are you like me and prefer not to focus on the negative?
I don’t really understand the hatred of shows around the anime fandom. Most of this hate probably comes from the narrowness the shows they prefer or have a strong feeling against it because the particular show or genre is popular. “Complaining about Shows You Don’t Watch” as described on TVtropes have become a very common tend because people think its cool to bash shows or fans of the genre even though they don’t even watch it. Unfortunately, most open-minded fans will look down to these people thinking that they are jerks. While people are entitled to their opinions, bashing it is not the answer and leads to pointless flamewars. This is probably a reason I avoid Anime Clubs and keep it to myself and people I trust in the Aniblogosphere and the internets.
You’re right, it’s one thing to complain about a show you’ve actually seen and it’s another to judge it when you haven’t even seen it yourself. Just going by what you’ve heard about it through the grape vine, or making false generalizations about all its fans because of how a few fans act, is ignorance, plain and simple. If you’re going to judge something at least know what you’re talking about.
I’ve encountered a fair amount of haters both in RL anime clubs and online. You can easily avoid them online by just staying away from their blogs, forums, etc., and hanging out at sites where people aren’t like that. For anime clubs you can’t really stay away from them if they’re part of the club. But I just try and tune them out and make friends with the people I like =)
Why do you hate Pandora Hearts? The manga is better but still the storyline is good. I seem to be the only male who likes it though…. >.>
“Even for Pandora Hearts and Heroic Age, two of the very few anime I’ve dropped, I wouldn’t say I hated them…”
As Myna quoted from my post, I specifically said I don’t hate Pandora Hearts. I just found it uninteresting, and when I fell behind on the episodes, I lacked the motivation to try and catch up.
You’ve pretty much echoed my thoughts exactly. This is precisely why I never understood haters. I watch anime for fun; why would I waste emotional energy hating on anime I don’t like?
Exactly, anime is meant to be enjoyed by a variety of fans, so naturally not every series will cater to your taste. Instead of wasting your time ranting about a show and making its fans upset, just stick to genres you like. Though I think a lot of the extreme haters just like the attention they get from the fandom they’re putting down.
Same here, I can’t say there are any characters or series that I especially hate (or even disdain), but there are characters (and usually their series as well) that I don’t like and prefer to avoid (and in some cases I’ll avoid the person who likes him/her/it). One example, and no hating on me please, is Naruto, I don’t like this character mostly because I’ve seen the series, dropped it, and come to the conclusion that I can’t support a ninja who, after years of supposed schooling, can’t even halfway decently win a fight (if it weren’t for the Nine Tailed Fox Spirit, he’d be useless), and then the series itself never seemed to move toward a definite ending. So, I don’t watch Naruto, but I won’t get on the street corner and proclaim its inferiority, but I’ll sit here and tell you what I like about other series.
In my opinion, if you’ve got nothing nice to say, find something you like to talk about (but don’t be obnoxious about it :3 )
Have you watched the second series? Naruto Shippuden? Where they are older? Its a bit better in my opinion.
I’ve seen it, it still doesn’t seem to move toward an ultimate ending or goal.
While I disagree about Naruto, I agree that it’s better to express yourself through the series you like rather than the ones you don’t. I’ve heard it’s even physically healthier for you to be calm and enjoy yourself (watching and discussing shows you like) than being frustrated and angry (watching and discussing shows you don’t like). And like you said, it’s good to talk about what you like but not to the point of being arrogant and obnoxious either XD
So it’s agreed, let’s get along and find a show we have in common. :3
Oddly enough, one reason why there are fans who “hate” certain kinds of shows and people who like those shows is precisely the same reason why you and I *don’t* hate shows — anime is a hobby and it gives them pleasure, but it gives them so much pleasure and they identify so much with it that it begins to affect their judgment, because their self-image or self-worth becomes linked to the kinds of anime they like. So being a fan of an anime they don’t like is akin to a personal insult. A comparable example of this kind of “hate” would be the kind of intense loathing shown by fans of one sports team for a rival team and its fans. (The recent fatal encounter between rival baseball fans in downtown LA comes to mind, although I’m glad so far no anime fan has been murdered for liking moeblobs!) Like you, I find certain series boring or dull, but never to the extent where I passionately detest them. Life is too short to waste on hating something like anime, especially when there’s so much more interesting stuff out there to watch.
That’s a good point, which why I try not to get too heated when talking about anime, unless I and the person I’m talking to share the same tastes in shows.
Wow, you’ve summed it up perfectly =) It think it can work both ways: you’re so passionate about anime that you find it insulting if someone’s a fan of a show you hate, and also if you love a certain anime you find it insulting if someone passionately hates it. I experienced a bit of the latter in middle school when my classmates would make fun of Pokemon all the time and when I told them it bothered me they’d be like “We’re making fun of Pokemon, not you.” I was so attached to Pokemon that it felt like they were bullying me every time they made fun of it.
Now that I’m older I don’t let stuff like that get to me. Anime is obviously a major part of my life but I prefer enjoying it rather than hating on people who like a series I don’t like or who hate a series I do like. What does get me rattled though is people who hate on anime in general (not a specific title). It bothers me more because I know they’re probably ignorant about anime than because it’s something I love. It frustrates me because I know they would have a different opinion if they knew exactly what anime entails the way I do.
Exactly, it’s one thing to take a series at face value and determine, logically, that you don’t prefer the show, and an entirely different case all together when a person just stays ignorant of something yet continues to do nothing but criticize it. I say you have no right to judge unless 1.) You can take judgement yourself 2.)You actually KNOW what you’re talking about…
Oh yes, I love making my hatred known.
As you know, my detestation towards K-ON! knows no bounds. And that I dislike any series without a plot and/or substance.
Just going from my ratings on MAL, I hate, or at least dislike, a large portion of series that I’ve watched. Some of them are just flat out bad, like some lame mahou shoujo titles. Others, like 07-Ghost, had an amazing start, and then plateaued into episodes that were half worn out jokes and half interesting.
Concerning series that I dropped…Eureka Seven goes into the 07-Ghost category, but it just dragged on too much, and watching the characters was like watching paint dry. I don’t hate Tegami Bachi by any means, but I couldn’t bring myself to care about any of the characters. And then there’s the Shakugan no Shana category, where it was just generic and painful in every aspect that it hurt. (Sorry, I know you like Shana.)
I do associate myself with the second example in your last paragraph, though I don’t think I’m as merciless against stereotypes and cliches as much as other people are. It does bother me when anime resorts to using them, but it really depends on how they’re executed.
If we’re talking about current hate, I’m currently hating on the second half of HanaIro. It’s terribly inconsistent, the writing is poor, some of it doesn’t make any sense, and the storytelling has just gone down the drain. (I really value consistency and good storytelling in anime.)
It is the last part of your comment that stuck out to me.
I have sometimes wondered if my standards for a good story have fallen, or that there are so many animes that are “bad,” that an average story automatically just stands out to me as “good.” I say this because some of the things you mention.
I have just started watching Shana, so I have no real comment on it yet.
Of course we could bat back and forth forever what makes a good story, and still get no closer to resolving it.
That’s a very good point. My standards for what I consider a good series have actually risen a lot since I was a new fan ten years ago. Back then I thought every anime I saw was awesome. But again, that’s when I only watched one new title every few months or so. Once I started following anime seasonally via streaming and bittorrent, I had way more anime under my belt and was able to compare lots of different series. With that, I was then able to see that some are certainly better than others. Even though my standards have risen, I still enjoy anime just as much as I used to. Maybe that’s the marking of a forever fan?
Hope you enjoy Shana. It’s not a great series but I find it has certain special qualities. Shana herself is a classic tsundere.
I do find Shana to be adorable (but I also like the tsundere archetype, classic or not)
I honestly just reflect on it more the more things that I watch. My standards are what I would consider to be relatively high, but I only really watch things I think I might enjoy. My scores are more based on my final feelings more than a lot of other things
On the flip side, I do at least try to watch a show outside of my “zone” every season.
I usually score things on a mix of technical value and personal enjoyment.
I.E. I didn’t really ENJOY watching Hourou Musuko, but its pacing and characterizations were great. So I ended up giving it an 8/10.
Heh, yes I know you don’t have any qualms about hating certain anime as much as loving certain ones.
“I do associate myself with the second example in your last paragraph…”
I was also thinking this since the anime you tend to have the highest praise for are “dare to be different” titles like Utena and Cowboy Bebop. Ultimately we’re all entitled to our own opinion. But even though you let your hate known, you do it on your own blog – I’m sure you don’t go around to K-ON forums and blogs and flame everyone there XD
Haha, yeah. Creativity and originality are really important to me. Though there’s nothing wrong with being generic, like Ao no Exorcist. As long as it has enough creative elements; whether it be in the characters or the setting, I still give it credit. It just can’t be so generic that it’s completely unoriginal.
Anime is a medium, so just like with movies and tv, I personally find I am bound to hate a few series I watch. I try and watch what I think I’d like, but sometimes I do hate some anime series with a passion. Like Dance in the Vampire Bund or H20 ~Footprints in the sand~, but I guess I can agree with you that even though I hate those series I would still give them a 4/10. I can’t see myself giving a show a lower rating than that because I guess I still managed to finish them. I like to think I’m open watching a lot of different genres myself, so my reasons behind hating something are more because the series didn’t tell a good story, it was boring or something else like that.
I actually find it easier to write about what I disliked in an anime over what I actually liked. When writing a review, its easier for me to come up with all the points to why I disliked something and be able to elaborate on that, but that’s just me probably and I also think it does depend. Sometimes when I truly love an anime or a specific character I just can’t stop talking about them.
It’s hard for me to imagine completing an anime I’d give a 4 or less rating to. Unless it’s just a movie or a short OVA, if I dislike it that much how could I have finished it?
Genre sometimes influences how I rate something. Even though there isn’t any genre I particularly dislike, I often find mecha series boring and shows with too much fan service annoying. But despite this I always just look at characters, story (unless it’s a plot-less slice of life show), art, music, direction, and other things like that.
Heh, I also found H20 disappointing. I did like how it ended though.
I’ve never hit the point where I hated a series all together. I may dislike some part of it but like you I can always find something to like in a series. For example, personally I really don’t like Haruhi in Suzumiya. I find her to be extremely annoying. However I do like the concept of the anime itself and I like the rest of the cast. I can understand why people get so riled up about certain animes and such but I still feel like it’s a waste of time.
That’s actually how I look at anime too. There’s very few, if any, in which I like everything about them. So if I find more good in them than bad, and if the bad isn’t unforgivably bad, I’ll have a decent opinion of them. That’s actually how I look at people too XD
Yeah, I’m not sure on that either. I really can’t come to hate some characters. I may dislike some a little, or find them bland as you said, but hate? Nah, not for me. I know they are not real either, and they are designed one way or another, so my logical thinking tells me that it would be pointless to hate them.
However, I can really like many other characters and relate to them pretty closely (forget they are unreal!). So I have to label myself as biased. But that is a bias I can live with, no problem :) It probably comes down to the same reason as you. Anime is a good hobby for me, one that makes me feel good. So I avoid anything that would make it feel “bad” for me in any way :D
You’re right, anime and its characters are for enjoyment, and my anger and hate are better reserved for things in the real world that will actually affect me. Anime is made to give us pleasure, not breed more negatively. If you find more negativity in it then maybe it’s time for a new hobby. But like I said in a comment above. I think a lot of haters enjoy the attention they get from bashing other people’s fandoms rather than genuinely wanting their opinions heard.
The only anime I truly hate are the ones I’ve forced myself to watch, often at the insistence of others, and sometimes of my own accord to better understand why the anime is well-liked. I know others can hate anime because it sends an offensive message (e.g., women should be subservient to men, suicide will make you happy, rape is a form of love) though I’ve never experienced this myself.
Heh, I don’t think I’ve ever forced myself to watch an anime because others are insisting, ’cause usually I’ll end up enjoying it anyway (which is often the case for the majorly popular titles) or I won’t even start watching it if I know it’s something I won’t like. If at any time it felt like force I would probably drop it =P
I also dislike anime that advocate things I find unjust or offensive. But usually I’ll know what these are beforehand and won’t even start watching them. So I don’t think any anime I’ve watched had that problem. I don’t mind if a series has some disturbing or offensive things as long as it’s not advocating those things and giving the message that they’re right and good. For example, in Now and Then Here and There, the villain abusing an animal is okay but if the protagonist that we’re supposed to be rooting for did it, that would be different.
There’s a few types of anime I can’t help but hate…
1. Animes that unexpectedly turns out to be a waste of time.
2. Animes that really failed to bring out the true potential of the writing/cast/original material.
3. And like what Baka-raptor said, ones that sends out an offensive or disturbing message.
But most of the time, the real reason I’ve came to hate a show is because I forced myself to finish (almost) every show I’ve started…
Oh… and you want to experience some hate for a character, maybe you should watch School Days, which I notice is absent from your MAL.
By an “unexpected waste of time,” do you mean anime with an unsatisfying ending? That could bother me too, but I try to look at the series overall when I judge it. Even if I thought the ending sucked, if I enjoyed all the other episode I wouldn’t say it was a waste.
Yeah, I can imagine forcing yourself to finish every show can make you more prone to hating certain ones rather than just sticking with the ones you like. That’s some admirable dedication.
I’ll keep School Days in mind.
Like you, I don’t tend to ‘hate’ series either. I may not find them interesting, in which case I’ll avoid watching them, but I don’t really see where ‘passionate hate’ of a series could stem from. Though I suppose if you were forced to watch something to the end, you might hate it… but I don’t remember the last time that happened for me.
Characters are another matter completely, though. I’m quite happy to love or hate characters – it adds to the watching experience. XD Besides, if a show has successfully managed to make me feel something towards the characters, be it positive or negative feelings, then it’s done quite well. There’s nothing worse than watching a series and finding that you didn’t give a crap about what happens to any member of the cast.
Great point about characters. If they make you feel something, even if it’s hate, that’s better than not feeling anything for them at all. Of course, you don’t want a series where you hate all the characters, but I’d say some love and some hate would be a good balance. I definitely think characters can be good characters even if they’re made to be detestable, like certain villains for example.
You barely ever rate a show 6.0/10? You must be easy to please…
There are special hating forums? Must be a pretty boring one-sided discussion. I always thought a hater is just someone who likes to voice his dislike for something, not a permanent job!
Like you said, some people just enjoy to overly defend their favorite anime and with that, comes hate for the opposite opinion. For instance, I could write a whole post about how Angel Beats! failed to deliver. I could even word the statements quite harshly. If I did that I would probably spark a few comments that would argue the opposite, not because of hate, but people tend to fly on the defense when it comes down to these things.
I am part of the second group and to a lesser extent the first group of (hater) viewers listed in your second to last paragraph; I’m only looking for and praising the best of the best. I’m happy to argue with anyone why this and that show is bad if they sought after the discussion, otherwise I just shut my mouth. In the end, it’s up to them whether they watch a show or not and not me.
The world is too bland if everyone just liked all forms of art and fictions without ever disputing about them. They’re meant to be enjoyed, yes. Everyone likes their own kind of art, yes. But there must be some reward for being more creative than others.
Yes, I’ll willingly admit that I’m extremely easy to please when it comes to anime. Not for all things, but for anime, yes XD
I don’t think hating forums are around much nowadays, but ten years ago when fan sites were popular, people would make web sites dedicated to bashing or hating on a certain character, series, pairing, etc,. I always avoided those.
Having a cordial debate where each side is voicing their opinion in a civilized manner and providing reasons for exactly why they feel that way, can be a healthy experience (though they usually just end with “you have your opinion, I have mine”). But when I think of haters and hating, I think of people specifically bashing other people’s fandom, often providing little to no reason or thought behind their hate. They just hate it for frivolous reasons like because it’s popular or they don’t like how certain fans of the series act.
I think the reward for being a more creative work is having more fans, being more memorable as time goes on, stuff like that. Of course that does require you to see the flaws in other works, but all the hate and flaming? I don’t think it’s needed to determine which work is better than another. So it’s just part of human nature I guess.
Reading your post, I agree with you wholeheartedly — well, there are a few things I can’t stand. I know that there are fans out there that really love what I might dislike, so I try to act as neutral and respectable as possible when confronted about it. I honestly wouldn’t appreciate it if someone says to my face they hate something I love.
But then again it depends. If I was with my friends, I wouldn’t hesitate to say what I dislike.
This is also an interesting point, with someone I don’t know, I tend to be more respectful of their (then unknown) preferences, but with my friends and with otaku I’m closer to, I tend to speak my mind more, knowing they can take what I have to say, and won’t just blindly get upset…
Now that I think about it, the only thing I hate when it comes to fiction is the Polish writter Sienkiewicz, although I’m not really sure it is true hate, I probably just dislike the fact that he was in the school canon here in Poland.
As to anime, I’m a seiyuu otaku, so I tend to grade shows focusing on acting, however, as much as I hate, par example, Omigawa Chiaki’s (Minchi in Hanasaku Iroha) voice, I never once thought about flameing her even in my imagination, after all, it’s not like I am the one paying the staff (by paying I mean real paying, not that metaphisical “buying dvds”).
When it comes to fandom, however, I hate haters, especially the loud ones, they’re just like atheists or feminists- they may have some points right, but they’re mostly missing the clou, it’s like (especially in the anti-plotless group) they would demand every pear to be an apple, failing to understand, that a pear is a “separate genere” of fruit and it is not mandatory to eat them.
I’m glad I’m not the only one who isn’t an Omigawa Chiaki fan. Her voice is just so…raw.
There are very few characters that I hate in anime. I disliked quite a few shows, but there will always be at least one character that I like. The most recent disappointment was Grenadier, something that I still regret watching, but none of the main characters were really easy to loathe.
About the only two anime that I hate everything from are Witch Hunter Robin and .hack//sign, and even those I can attribute to just not being my cup of tea, rather than being genuinely awful.
I mean hell, even with my lukewarm feelings toward the bewilderingly beloved Clannad, Tomoya is one of my favorite anime protagonists. Even as much as I can’t stand K-ON!, Ritsu is endearing enough not to make me hate her as I do the rest of the cast.
In spite of how jaded I can be, I cannot really say I hate that many titles or characters.
What I find interesting is how that I am equally passionate about music, yet I can find music that I hate with ease and it takes serious effort to conjure that same hate in relation to anime/characters from anime.
However, one character I despise with a passion is Shinji Matou from Fate/Stay Night; he raped Sakura and damaged her psychologically, which seriously pisses me off. Adding insult to injury, he tried to rape Rin in the Unlimited Blade Works movie before Lancer drove a spear into his shoulder.
Wow, this is such a good topic! I also find it extremely hard to talk about anime/chracters I hate, because firstly, I just can’t bring myself to hate anything. Unless it’s so horribly bad, but then again I really haven’t seen much that’s on that level. I drop most anime mostly because I can’t understand it well, not because I don’t like it. As for characters, besides the really mean ones that are mean for absolute no reason, i generally like all characters. I think it’s just a much happier experience talking about what we like than hate.